RBE, problems to consider


Been thinking on RBE for some time, what I keep coming back to is how to convince the masses that this is workable, how to convince the “one percent” as well as the business community and government that this can work. I haven’t read everything here but I haven’t seen anything about how to begin beyond talking about it. Any ideas out there?

From some  of what I have read it seems to indicate the desire to use technology to do as much work as possible, I would consider that to be a great mistake. I believe an RBE can only work if all the citizens contribute to society, if too much time is available for personal use we become lazy and forget how to do anything for ourselves and expect to be “entitled” to everything. A society must be designed with the right balance of work, play, education and responsibility to society. Also an RBE could provide the opportunity to get back some of the knowledge and skills that we have already lost.

Another problem to consider is that it would be near impossible to begin on a world wide scale, it must begin with a single country, one with not too large but a varied and educated population, an abundance of natural resources, a reasonably peaceful society and a good world wild reputation, sounds like Canada to me. Success in Canada would demonstrate the viabillty of an RBE.

15 thoughts on “RBE, problems to consider

  1. I agree with Joe L. When everyone is able to follow their dreams,their passion, or just have the opportunity to use AND expand their natural talents, WHATEVER they may be, without fear of being controlled OR being in control of others, we JUST MIGHT miss out on war, crime, greed, famine , poverty, ETC !!!

  2. It is my belief that we are co-creators of our world and to that end visionaries are required. To me it is not a matter of if a NLRBE comes into play but when. Just as in writing any story it is easier to start at the end, introduce parameters and let the story tell itself (evolve) from there. I have written a free eBook on this and am now working on a sequel. Get the ebook here, sequoiablessed.info/page94 and the sequel project is found here, alovebasedsociety.wordpress.com/ I would love to hear any thoughts you may have on this latest project of mine. 🙂

  3. I have not found any reference to the rights of our worlds non human species (citzens) in any RBE discussions. Are they considered just another resource? We also have the technological ability to create
    meats and substitutes without enslaving and killing other sentient life forms. I believe there are only two
    forces that move minds. 1- Spiritual or love based, and 2- Legal or fear based. Unfortunately #2 has
    high jacked #1 in the big religions. I believe a new spiritual approach may be a key mover.
    Laws are subject to manipulation and misuse whereas principals are not.
    I have been an atheist for the first 50 years of my life yet i am no longer. I expeienced a gnosis that changed my perspective entirely. I believe in none of todays religions nor Gods. My belief is that DNA is the only living being
    on this planet and that we humans are her most able expressions. We are the opposing thumb of God.
    I have hypothosis and tools for percieving that which we have not been conscious of. If anybody is interested
    in exploring this I would love to share. BTW. Bovines for example consume a lot of resorces to produce little product, and contribute to polution too.

    1. I’d like to hear about your hypothesis and tools. There’s a new documentary coming out called “Cowspiracy” which looks like it will have good information on the destruction of forests, rivers, and such.

  4. The conceptualization of an RBE is just one perspective on the upcoming predominant social-economic paradigm. Valuable for consideration of where we might be headed, yes. The end-all be-all answer to all our current predominant industrial-scarcity paradigm woes, no.

    Since entering scarcity some ten thousand years ago, we have used centralized governance systems. Centralized governance systems have a central point of failure. Cut off the head, the rest crumbles. That is why coups and attacking country capitals work so well.

    As a civilization, we have improved the resilient with decentralized systems (several smaller heads), like what happened with the formation of the United *States* of America at the beginning of the industrial revolution and, later with the refactored EU. Yet, it is still in a top-down approach, leaving governance process innovations and refactoring by front-line citizens a real pain to accomplish.

    The most resilient organization form are networks, such as fungi networks, and the Internet. Each node is not subservient to any other, and works with the other nodes adhering to simple established protocols. Networks have a bottom-up approach.

    What is, however, the ideal size for a node in a governance network? A person, a family aggregate, a building, a block, a settlement/neighborhood, a city, a region or a continent?

    Since 2011, when I started waking up starting with the Zeitgeist films and kept going further, I have tried many approaches, most which led nowhere. I currently focus on transition from the block/neighborhood perspective and look forward to establish protocols with neighboring settlements in a bottom-up approach. Working with people you know on a regular basis (because they are close), being able to easily share resources and you know start to learn the terrain like the palm of your hand seems to me to be the sweet spot in effectiveness of what anyone can do right now. To start doing fun things with your neighbors by building local resilience is something you don’t need to convince the 1%. You convince the 1% by not needing to buy the products and services from them. The most effective way to destroy a cancer is to starve it from a nutrient source which is exclusive to it. If the 1% don’t get paid in fiat currency, which is their current strategy for survival, they have no other option than to re-evaluate their approach to life.

    There are many people/organizations/movements/initiatives that have already been having this kind of approach for the past months/years/decades. I suggest taking a look at:
    – The Transition Network: www.transitionnetwork.org and the latest movie www.youtube.com/watch?v=FFQFBmq7X84
    – Permaculture: the Geoff Lawton videos give you a quick glimpse of the principles in action www.geofflawton.com
    – Global Ecovillage Network: gen.ecovillage.org/
    – Intentional Communities: www.ic.org/
    – Team Better Block: teambetterblock.com/
    – Open Source Ecology: opensourceecology.org/ and www.youtube.com/watch?v=zIsHKrP-66s&list=PL5DD5E8447F3CD3F0

    There is a news site I follow which has many more resources to these and other similar projects: www.resilience.org/ .

    And one other thing I recommend for anyone (if they are drawn to it), is starting and *finishing* their spiritual seeking. I insist on finishing because most human beings for the past centuries have stayed in “spiritual cul-de-sacs” their adult lives. By spiritual seeking, I mean rediscovering who you are at the root of your being, becoming in tune with the cosmos’ natural flow. Just get that out of the way ASAP to appreciate the unfolding of life clearly, without being velcroed to any one perspective. I.e., be free. If you can/want, that is. It is all good either way :). The late Alan Watts’ “Out of Your Mind” audio lesson compendium would be one of my first recommendations for a western, technically inclined audience, with a touch of humor.

    I hope the pointers prove useful. Enjoy the discovery :).

  5. If you are interested in the idea of a Resource Based Economy, you should really look into The Venus Project. Jacque Fresco, the founder was I believe, the first to coin the name and has essentially dedicated his life toward seeing its implementation. Most of your questions about the idea, and the project itself will have been answered on the project website: www.thevenusproject.com

    Another place to look for people who have more recently begun advocating for a global RBE is The Zeitgeist Movement: www.thezeitgeistmovement.com

    I hope this helps 🙂

  6. Thank you for all your comments and continuing my education, a never ending task!

    eddie, you are correct to a point but clearly not all of us have gone lazy and I should have stated that.I meant that too many more people would get that way. Requirements to contribute time & effort will surly be necessary.

    Sequoia, I agree that unlimited energy is one of the things necessary for an RBE but which will come first? We can only imagine the opposition to unlimited energy! Iceland, there’s a thought, some thing else for me to look at.

    Joe, probably true for most but what to do about those who are truly lazy and those passions that don’t contribute to society? Some postings on that issue.

    wecespedes, point one, yes, all of what you say is true but what about those who have “made it” and see that change is needed?
    point two..see above to Joe.
    point three, I agree with what you say but that doesn’t mean it can’t change. Also, education will be very important as it always is. One thing I would point out is that things are not so “black & white” as you seem to think. I have been thinking on a way to begin that change and that would be to revert back to the original parliament structure, that is to remove the political parties from parliament. There are some in the Canadian establishment who agree with this, to make it happen is another thing but not impossible.
    I’m wondering if per-hapes you would have any ideas about how to advance the idea of an RBE.
    In the mean time I will continue to educate myself and I think that every body can help with discussions like this.

  7. One, I don’t agree, Tobiano, with your idea that we need to enlist and ‘to convince the “one percent” as well as the business community and government’
    Two, I don’t agree, Tobiano, ‘if too much time is available for personal use we become lazy and forget how to do anything for ourselves and expect to be “entitled” to everything.’
    Three, I don’t agree, Tobiano, ‘it would be near impossible to begin on a world wide scale, it must begin with a single country, one with not too large but a varied and educated population, an abundance of natural resources, a reasonably peaceful society and a good world wild reputation, sounds like Canada to me’

    It’s plain to see that structures of power are never going to go along with any ideas that remove their advantage. These people are the product of a system that has rewarded them immensely, the example at anytime in history where a powerful structure has gone quietly into the night, does not exist. So asking the 1%, the business community, the government to cooperate is to ignore their vested interest that will motivate them to sabotage the effort. This is an answer to the first point.
    The 2nd point, TEDx talks abound that focus on the creative capacity of people who when left to do what they want will be very busy contributing to their communities. NLRBE addresses the basic needs allowing for the development of systems that can guide people to fulfilling their other needs, ie, self actualization.
    The 3rd, and most obvious, the present Empire has being hunting and destroying peaceful cultures from its birth to the present, because It is built upon a war time economy. It loves to blow shit up, and then pretend it will build it up again. As for Canada like Saudi Arabia, they are in subjection to this Empire.
    While most people want immediately gratification, the recognition that Natural Law is what we need to be guided by, we have to focus on educating and encouraging people to be as informed as possible. To look for ways to build communities of like minded people. To help the young to think outside the box.
    You my friend, Tobiano, learn more about the train of thought. You might come up with an idea that works with Natural Law and the Open Source movement. The wide and varied movements that advocates change now. Good luck.

    1. Thoroughly agree with you. The ruling class will fight this change tooth and nail. Our only advantage is they depend upon others who can potentially be swayed against the current sysem

  8. If people didn’t have to worry about earning the right to live, they would have the time and freedom to follow their passion and create and give back to society, civilization and our planet. I believe people would welcome the opportunity to pursue their passion rather than lay around being lazy and non productive.

  9. Change occurs in spurts, usually around an invention and a desire for a more comfortable life. Look at history for examples of this. The industrial revolution started gradually from late 1700’s and leaped forward in the mid-1800’s, been growing ever since. Fossil fuels are largely responsible for this growth. The fuel behind RBE’s growth will be renewable energy in many diverse forms as well as fusion energy. Products will become so cheap to produce that people will just stop charging for them and RBE will be the logical next step. It is our belief in scarcity which traps us in the current economy, along with greed and selfish behavior. With unlimited energy comes the confidence to let go of clinging to false prophets (money). I too see this happening in a smaller country with plenty of resources, such as Canada or Iceland. I think Iceland has the potential to be the starting point because it already runs of renewable energy, is isolated, and has resources enough to be independent. Once someone makes the move others will follow rather quickly I think. There will be hold outs no doubt, but fewer than most believe. We are more connected than people realize, esp. today with the internet and travel options. Check out this article on the IR, www.princeton.edu/~achaney/tmve/wiki100k/docs/Industrial_Revolution.html
    Free energy is the key to pushing the NLRBE forward! IMHO

  10. We have already become lazy and also forgotten how to do anything ourselves. You can’t design a society because you can’t design people’s lives without robbing them of freedom. If given the time and freedom people would naturally create art society would become living art

    1. I agree with eddie. Along with knowledge (a totally different school system! – Like Sir Ken Robinson and Alfie Kohn suggest) and freedom, people (at least a lot of us) will start to create and do a lot of good things that will benefit society in the end.

      I don’t think we will get lazy because with knowledge and far better education we will not just sleep our life away… We should then want to do something with our skills and our knowledge. I am sure of that.

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